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25 July 2006 @ 02:55 pm
This bothers me...  
I need the opinions of my LJ friends!

I joined this LJ community for "Project Runway" and came across THIS post -


**I had to be the girl who posts this, but I'm just so curious...

How many of the males this season are of the homosexual nature...?

Oh come on I know a lot of you were wondering too..**


Sadly, this post drew like 68 replies (which I foolishly read), mostly silly stuff about the sexuality of the guys on the show, but many were pretty insulting. I know how many people think of gays and you'd think I'd be numb to it...but I guess I'm not! I replied to this person with the following...


~~Why exactly were you wondering?

I'm curious...next will we discuss who is Jewish or Muslim or Catholic? Maybe who has a black or white or Asian parent or grandparent? Who was poor white trash? Who was a spoiled rich kid? Who has a relative in prison?

I wonder how long this post would have remained up if comparable things to "the rest are flying queens" and "the screamingest nelly queen" were made about any other minority?~~


Was I out of line? Was I overreacting?

One of the few who questioned this post was immediately attacked and accused of acting "holier than thou" and "not respecting the opinions of others"! I'm quite sure that I will have an inbox full of nasty replies too...so, please tell me... Am I being too sensitive? Overreacting?

A LINK INCASE YOU WANT TO READ THE COMMENTS...

http://community.livejournal.com/projectrunway/460604.html



.
 
 
 
gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 07:18 pm (UTC)
Yes. I think you are being oversensitive.

What, you mean you've never watched a reality show and thought, "I wonder if he's gay"? Of course you have. What's wrong with that? Does it mean you are secretly homophobic? of course it doesn't.
The Queen Beebyrne on July 25th, 2006 07:25 pm (UTC)
Oh, please.

That doesn't mean it's at all acceptable for them (any them) to post in a way that marginalizes, degrades or puts down people of ANY minority. All that it *does* mean is that we have a lot of work to do. I know very well that we will never ever live in a world where all is peace and light, but we can at least live in a world where people aren't utter asshats for the sake of being asshats.

Putting a face on the ubiquitous 'them' is not over reacting. It's self-defense. Standing up and saying "Hey, look at what you're saying and what that says about you and me" is not an overreaction; it's standing up and not taking it any more.

In short, go Mark.
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 08:54 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - slavetopassion on July 25th, 2006 10:21 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:27 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - ultimategirl on July 26th, 2006 12:49 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 08:50 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 09:00 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 09:11 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 09:37 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - pixee_led on July 25th, 2006 09:54 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 10:03 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - pixee_led on July 25th, 2006 10:34 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 10:39 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:09 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 11:27 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:56 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 26th, 2006 01:02 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 26th, 2006 01:21 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 26th, 2006 01:45 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 26th, 2006 04:22 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:06 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - slavetopassion on July 25th, 2006 10:24 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 10:40 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - slavetopassion on July 25th, 2006 11:04 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 11:29 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - slavetopassion on July 25th, 2006 11:31 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gregstevenstx on July 25th, 2006 11:35 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - slavetopassion on July 25th, 2006 11:36 pm (UTC) (Expand)
St. Rougarougogoangelgunboy on July 25th, 2006 07:34 pm (UTC)
i don't think you were overreacting, but i suspect that's what the replies will say, so be prepared *grin*

i just can' believe anyone's keeping SCORE...*laughing*

Mark: angel rainbowboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 08:56 pm (UTC)
LOL! I'm sure I'll get blasted, Gabe...but, it's like...why don't you see posts like...I wonder how many are (insert fav religion)...or, I wonder if any of them are Irish...or Italian, etc...y'know?
(no subject) - gogoangelgunboy on July 25th, 2006 09:29 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:03 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(Deleted comment)
Mark: Angel never aloneboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 08:59 pm (UTC)
Re: well
YES! Exactly, Mark! It's more for me...WHY do you want to know?
You don't ask about their religion, political views or ethnicity...because it's not funny to you if they are Catholic...or German or Polish...or if they are Republican!
ex_applehead554 on July 25th, 2006 08:05 pm (UTC)
Sometimes I see guys and think to myself, "I wonder if he's gay?". Of course, those are the guys I'm attracted to and it doesn't happen all the time.
I don't think I've ever seen a guy, hot or not, and thought, "I wonder if he's straight?", but in the end, it just doesn't matter, however it does cross my mind.
As for the answers she got, whatever they were (and I'm sure some were uncalled for) it just goes to show that gays are more openminded and accepting than straights. I mean, you don't hear me calling the straight guy next door dirty names. well not often, and never just because he happened to be born straight (poor guy).
1. No I don't think you were out of line.
2. I haven't read all their responses so I don't know if you over reacted or not.
3. Ignore the emails.
Mark: comic heartbeat Jerry mouseboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 09:02 pm (UTC)
Thanks, Mike! Like I told Mark...it's the WHY do you want to know?
LOL...and it's natural for us to wonder! It's a necessity even!

(I added a link if you want to see the responses...but, I won't blame you if you don't!)

*smooch*
Kadiexokadieox on July 25th, 2006 08:13 pm (UTC)
I dont think you're being too sensitive.. I think its completely random to ask that question to begin with. But maybe thats just because I'm the type of person who doesnt feel like one's sexuality relates to how they do their job (or other things that dont invlove attraction to a certain sex). For example: how does being gay, lesbian, bi, straight whatever affect how you design clothes? I don't think it does, Therefor I dont think its a viable question. Its totally one thing to think it in your head "hm i wonder if he's gay" but totally uneccessary to present to livejournal community for discussion. If I were in that community.. I would have said something as well.
Markboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 09:07 pm (UTC)
Thank you so much, Kadie! My thoughts exactly! I just worry about the motivation behind the question, y'know?
I really try not to be sensitive about such things...but there were 70 replies (now)...why is it so interesting to them?

*hug*
(no subject) - xokadieox on July 26th, 2006 02:08 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 26th, 2006 04:53 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - xokadieox on July 26th, 2006 05:13 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 26th, 2006 05:51 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - xokadieox on July 26th, 2006 07:28 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 26th, 2006 11:34 pm (UTC) (Expand)
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(no subject) - boywondermark on July 27th, 2006 01:21 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Araythea: Pridearaythea on July 25th, 2006 09:19 pm (UTC)
I can totally see what you mean but I really don't think that anything horrid was meant by it.

People are going to wonder about the participants. Not just there sexuality but everything about them. I think that this was meant along the same vein, and while it certainly isn't polite or sensitive, I can't say that I'm surprised.

I'm very sorry that you were hurt and upset by it. ♥hugs♥
Mark: Calvin Hobbes Hugboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 09:57 pm (UTC)
Thanks, sweetie! I was more bothered by it than actually hurt!

*big hug*
Aurélienorey on July 25th, 2006 09:23 pm (UTC)
i'mma get stoned but..
I don't think you wer being over sensitive but at the same time I don't think the question was out of line lol. homosexuals (mind you i am one oh shocker) have the reputation to define themselves by their sexuality (sic). is that true in reality? I don' tthink it is for a vast majority of us but how do you expect people who aren't (gay) to know exactly what's going under the surface....
On top of it a lot of immature and underaged people roam on the internet with nothing but sexual aggressivity to vent....
next time be more sensitive and ask the poster who she thinks does oral exclusively and who's into double p. ;)
Love you.
Mark: Run for your lifeboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 09:59 pm (UTC)
Re: i'mma get stoned but..
OMG! You're gay?! LOL!!!

Thanks for the words, Aure! *smooch*
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 25th, 2006 10:00 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:08 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 25th, 2006 10:09 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:18 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 25th, 2006 10:19 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:26 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 25th, 2006 10:28 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:30 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 25th, 2006 10:30 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:54 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 25th, 2006 10:55 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:19 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 26th, 2006 10:37 am (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 26th, 2006 04:44 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 26th, 2006 05:07 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 26th, 2006 05:49 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 26th, 2006 09:40 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 26th, 2006 11:39 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 27th, 2006 06:03 am (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 27th, 2006 01:34 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 27th, 2006 01:37 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 27th, 2006 03:59 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - orey on July 27th, 2006 04:01 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Re: i'mma get stoned but.. - boywondermark on July 27th, 2006 08:59 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Jase: gay chestslavetopassion on July 25th, 2006 10:03 pm (UTC)
I think there are different ways that question can be inflected in speech that would cause different reactions from me. There are times when I see a woman and wonder if my gaydar is right when I wonder if she is a lesbian but I dont mean it in a bad way even though I have no sexual interest in her.

That being said, I dont think the people in that community were being respectful or even just mildly curious. They were being judgmental and hateful.

I think as gays, we can back into the crowd and be invisible but at some point if we want rights, we are going to have to say something, make a stand. We have to make people see that bigotry is bigotry.

I love you!
~kisses~
Mark: gay qaf hot hugboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:09 pm (UTC)
Thanks, baby! ~hugs and smooches~
pixee_led on July 25th, 2006 10:09 pm (UTC)
Simple question, complex answer...

1) No, I don't think you were being overly sensitive. You were being a member of a highly stigmatized minority group in a crowd of people who were making borderline rude comments about your group (or about how to tell who's a member of your group.) Some of those comments came close to saying that I can tell which people are Jewish by looking at how pushy they are, or (if visuals weren't provided) I can tell how many are black by how long they've been out of work. Straights are always thinking they have this great gaydar, but it only works for the most flaming of us. I imagine for guys like you and me and a lot of others we wouldn't make their gaydar ping at all.

Having said that, I think you have to expect people who watch Runway to be a least somewhat intrigued by sexuality for a number of reasons.

2. Keep in mind what Gabe said: for a lot of folks this is their first real dip into a widely gay subculture. (Gay men may even come close to being a majority in the design world.) The idea that there is more than one token gay "character" on a tv show is just plain weird to them. I swear I heard a collective gasp from middle America last season when Daniel talked about coming out. ("But he doesn't act gay!!")

3. The Bravo channel is really marketing itself as a gay-friendly network. Just a quick look at their site and you can see all the programs and blogs and extras that cater to the gay community. So, once again, people who like what they have to offer may be more aware of/intrigued by questions of sexual orientation.

4. What you said about maturity really rings true to me. You can tell by the way they talk about it in the thread that a lot of those posting comments are very young. To that group there is this really weird love/hate thing going with tehGeh. On one hand, there are all those "are-they-or-aren't-they" bands out there that make cute emo boys want to kiss each other. On the other hand, there's no better way to cut a guy down than to suggest that he's gay. So I think there's a real tittilation factor going on. Hopefully in 50 years that won't even be an issue.
Mark: angel rainbowboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 10:15 pm (UTC)
All well thought out and well said, Adey! LOL! I think I should have had you write a response for me, hon! :)

*smooch*
Su: sleepyralphiere on July 25th, 2006 10:41 pm (UTC)
Look at what I miss when my laptop's out of commission!

Sweetie, I think what you said was perfectly acceptable. The question was absolutely worded in an inappropriate manner. After reading what everyone wrote, I have to agree with many of them (Jase and Adey to name two).

Mark: comic Naruto smileboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:14 pm (UTC)
Thanks, Su Bear! I missed you!

*smooch*
(no subject) - ralphiere on July 25th, 2006 11:18 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - boywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:43 pm (UTC) (Expand)
lomelinde_sama on July 25th, 2006 11:05 pm (UTC)
I had a moment where I just blew up at a narky sixteen-year-old for calling people who didn't like her OTP 'faggots' on fanficrants back when I was a member. Believe me, it took a hell of a lot of ass chewing before the dumbass realized that she had actually said something offensive.

I don't call that overreacting, I call that knowing where the lines are and when not to cross them.
Mark: comic sideways goyjoboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:34 pm (UTC)
Thank you, D! Y'know...I hate conflict, so it wasn't like I was looking for an argument...I just thought that the post and most of the replies were insensitive and inconsiderate.

*hugs*
Michaelmikey89 on July 25th, 2006 11:08 pm (UTC)
I don't think you over reacted.. What was the intent of the question or why does it matter if any of these guys are gay.. (I don't watch the show btw, not my cup of tea) I did read all the comments but I am still not sure if it was just a simple question of curiosity or if it was more insipid. I think your response to her is valid, "Why does it matter?
Mark: Calvin Hobbes Hugboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:35 pm (UTC)
Thank you, Mikey! That's what I wanted to know!

*hug*
turtleinashell on July 25th, 2006 11:10 pm (UTC)
No, you're not overreacting, you freaking homo! .... OOPS! Read too many negative comments, I guess. hehe.

Seriously, this business about "who's gay" is so immature of people. We shouldn't tolerate it.
Mark: Carsonvenus oh shtboywondermark on July 25th, 2006 11:40 pm (UTC)
LOL! Thanks, Paul!

It's like being at a party for Republicans and asking..."So, are you a Democrat?"
Deboraherryl on July 25th, 2006 11:56 pm (UTC)
I don't think you are overeacting to this at all. This girl should know that even curiousity has its limits. It shouldn't matter if you are gay or not. In the show they are judged on talent not whether they are gay or not.
Mark: comic KYOboywondermark on July 26th, 2006 12:13 am (UTC)
Thank you, sweetheart! I feel the same way! *big hug*
Treed1979a_trick_mind on July 26th, 2006 12:37 am (UTC)
You were right on, however, I don't think you should have been so surprised to see those comments. It is not as protected perhaps as some other communities.
Mark: angel rainbowboywondermark on July 26th, 2006 12:46 am (UTC)
I really shouldn't have been surprised, Tim. I just get so disappointed when anyone treats any group of people as something to be laughed at...did that make sense? LOL...I'm rambling, but I think you see what I mean.